That conversation.

Pat and I talked about this illustration of Lazarus' death as for discipleship.

Lazarus as a dead person represents those who encountered Christ but chose to not leave the world, those Christians who are still walking in the ways of the world.
Mary as someone who argued with God telling to not revive Lazarus since he is already dead for like 3 days, and that he might be also stinky, represented those disciplers or other people who lost the courage that God is able to change those people who are once called but made a decision on their own.
And Jesus, represented Himself that very loving person, who wept for the death of His friend and commanded Lazarus to wake up.

God is not finished with those people. We might be discouraged but Jesus wept and became positive for those people. That from being dead, so lost/deaf/drowned their emotions, once Jesus once and for all called for them, the won't be able to resist.

And as Lazarus went out from his tomb, there were still the cloths in his body. As a those persons who see those clothes, we should help those persons to take it out from his body, to take the bandages that blinds that person to see who Jesus is. Those bandages, dirty clothes are the old us - the habits, attitudes, thinking, ways - which is being stripped off in us.

Other than those clothes being bondage for other people, it also speaks with the stubbornness or pride that one has. Normally, in a funeral, even if how much we talk with the dead to come back alive, they won't, for don't have the power at all; Stubborn/Prideful people won't be listening to whatever we are trying to say. But what happened during the time of Jesus was an awesome thing to happen. Lazarus came back to life. It was just Jesus' words that made Lazarus got out from the grave; this displays the power of God that His chastening, even without physical attachment, is powerful; that when He is already the one to rebuke, then there's no helping but to reflect on what's wrong.

God is not finished with us yet. God gave us hope in everything, so there's no giving up!